lemurgoddess ([info]lemurgoddess) wrote,
@ 2006-08-11 10:33:00
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Entry tags:in the news

I meant to say... THEOCRATIC facists...
Bush: U.S. at war with 'Islamic fascists'

There is nothing particularly spectacular about this article, the standard rhetoric. But I just found something strange about the following comments by Nihad Awad of the Council on American-Islamic Relations in response to the president using the term "Islamic Fascists":


We believe that this is an ill-advised term and we believe that it is counterproductive to associate Islamic Muslims with fascism...

No offense Awad, but I think that is a pretty damn accurate term to desribe some of these psychos that want to destroy us. I'm not going to sit here and say that some small part of venom Muslims/Arabs/etc. have for America isn't justified, but the violent actions of so many of these groups is COMPLETELY UNjustified. The same mentality that births suicide bombing of the innocent bystanders is the same fucked up mentality that demands authoritation control!

Maybe the term "Islamic Fascists" isn't the best term... I think "theocratic" and "fucking nuts" needs to be inserted in there somewhere.


"We ought to take advantage of these incidents to make sure that we do not start a religious war against Islam and Muslims...

IN the minds fo the terrorists, this is already the case.

To be honest, I think there SHOULD be a religious war. A war BETWEEN Muslims and Islam! Those Muslims that aren't crazy-assed psychos should be fighting to reign in the extremist sects. The religions is in desperate need of reform. As well, I'd suggest a war between Christians and Christianity in the US as well.


We urge him and we urge other public officials to restrain themselves...

Bush hasn't nuked IRan yet, has he? I think that's about as much restraint as we are going to see from that guy. XD


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[info]angieohgirl
2006-08-11 04:12 pm UTC (link)
Check out news in regard to August 22nd. All the stuff going on has nothing to do with Bush. If anything he has stopped a bunch of attacks in our country and while working with the UK has stopped things over there.

Islam is after one thing, the death of all infidels. I've been checking out somet things and Islams are taught that there is a time where it is 'death to all infidels are we all die trying'. This is their faith and what they are taught.

There is a focus on Aug. 22nd. I posted a thing by an Islamic specialist (who worked with Bush and Clinton administration) and he states some pretty intense things.

We, as Americans, need to be wise and on guard with things going on around us. As this guy said, when we were at war with Russia, both countries didn't want there to be a nuclear war. With Islam they don't care if they die. To die is to gain for them.

Some scary crap and its about time the news media takes their heads out of their butts and quit being so 'politically correct' and start calling a spade a spade before 911 looks like a small incident.

That's my conspiracy theory rant for today. :)

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[info]lemurgoddess
2006-08-11 04:46 pm UTC (link)
All the stuff going on has nothing to do with Bush. If anything he has stopped a bunch of attacks in our country and while working with the UK has stopped things over there.

I made no commentary about Bushes performance, so I'm not sure where this commentary came from.


Islam is after one thing, the death of all infidels. I've been checking out somet things and Islams are taught that there is a time where it is 'death to all infidels are we all die trying'. This is their faith and what they are taught.

That is a generalization. There IS a huge under current of anti-semitism and "death to infidels" by and large in the "modern" Muslim teachings, so its not a completely absurd generalization to make, but it is still a generalization. There are those who believe that the tenets of Islam do NOT lead to murder and violence -- many of these sorts adhere to policies of Pacifism. I generally see the current state of Islam as sort of what Christianity would be like if people like Robertson became the super-majority viewpoint in the faith. "Convert or die" bullshit et al. This is the reason for my "Muslims vs. Islam" and "Christians vs. Christianity" proclaimations, more sane and civilized sects of the religious faiths need to tell the wackos to sit down and shut up.

Not succumbing to hyperbole is not the same as being "politically correct."


Some scary crap and its about time the news media takes their heads out of their butts and quit being so 'politically correct' and start calling a spade a spade before 911 looks like a small incident.

Agreed, but we must also make sure we don't become hateful, paranoid citizens who forgo freethought and abolish disenting opinion to raise up the President-Idol, in the name of being "safe." If that's what this country became, I'd probably have to blow things up as well (V is for Vendetta-style!!) XD

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[info]angieohgirl
2006-08-11 05:17 pm UTC (link)
"I made no commentary about Bushes performance, so I'm not sure where this commentary came from."
Wasnt made towards you. Was made towards the public's general mis-informed idea's of what is really going on.

And I'm sorry but I disagree with the generalization. I hear more and more from specialists, not nutcases or such, but people who have studied this faith and their teachings and how they conduct themselves that this is a very big thing. And just watch over the next days and weeks, there are going to be more and more arrets. I am not sure if you read anything by Bernard Lewis but I would recommend you check it out. Here is an article by him I posted.
http://angieohgirl.livejournal.com/42765.html#cutid1

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[info]lemurgoddess
2006-08-11 05:31 pm UTC (link)
I hear more and more from specialists, not nutcases or such, but people who have studied this faith and their teachings and how they conduct themselves that this is a very big thing.

And how often have you spoken to Muslims?

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[info]angieohgirl
2006-08-11 05:49 pm UTC (link)
Well, to be honest, I don't talk to many because most of the time I don't know who is and who isn't. I'm not really the type to go up to someone and say "Hey, are you muslim, I have some questions." Most of the time when I am out and enjoying myself I only have one goal, enjoy myself.

Since you have friends that are muslim (I am assuming keep in mind) how many of them have been angry about the terrorist attempts, 911, the bombings, etc...?

BTW, have you heard there is a new Celldweller due out soon?

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[info]lemurgoddess
2006-08-11 06:11 pm UTC (link)
Portland, Maine has a significant Muslim immigrant population, and a good many of them work as over-night housekeepers at the hospital I work at (a Catholic Hospital, no less). When I was working evenings I would often cross paths with them. I eventually got over my xenphobia and tried to communicate. I never specifically got into things like 9/11 (that's a barbed topic that I don't haphazardly evoke). Instead I spoke with them like any other normal human being. They talked about their families, about where they came from, what it was like to live hear in the states. Overtime I came to understand that these people were no different from so many other people. They appreciate the freedoms they have here in the states, and desire little more in this world than to work hard and raise their families. Most of them came to America to ESCAPE the psychos that dominate our perception of Islam -- to have a chance to lead a peaceful life free from persecution.

"Specialists" are all well and good, a great source of information, but I think its important to not rely entirely on their conclusions. If we do we can come to see their subjects as mere objects of study, and forget the basic humanity behind it all. Muslims are people. And because of that each individual holds a unique perspective and works with a unique understanding and interpretation of the world. Sure some (hell MOST) may want to destroy "infidels" and conquer the world, but there are plenty that do not. There are those who have the same dreams and desires as you are I. Your generalization, no matter how often it can be accurately applied, is still irresponsible and dehumanizing hyperbole.

There are liberal movements in Islam and Muslims fighting against the stupidity that dominates their faith.


Yar! I've heard he will be working more with Criss Angel in the future as well. When Klayton was talking on his MySpace a while back about considering/but un sure about working again with an "old friend" my wife and I thought for sure he meant Darren (also of KlanK), and that perhaps Circle of Dust was getting back together.

No such luck.

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[info]angieohgirl
2006-08-11 07:32 pm UTC (link)
Thanks for the information, I appreciate it, but I am done talking to you on this. BTW, that woman seems pretty cool but she has a mountain to climb. However, you have sent put-downs at me and talked down to me enough that I find you to not be so nice to talk with. Why you can't talk to me openly without stating things that make it seem like I have nothing good to say is frustrating.

I am sure you feel you are 'educating' me but what is funny is you probably will not read any of what I sent you because you refuse to feel I have anything of worth to say or know. I guess you feel you are the 'specialist' eventhough the people I told you to read are professors at universities and have studied this faith, dealt with people of the faith and studied what is going on for a very long time.


I guess we just keep to the subject of music. Does Klayton have a personal myspace? I have the myspace page for 'Celldweller'. Did you see the Criss Angel video with Vince Neil directing? I saw it on MTV or something. I wish Criss would go on a full tour. Would love to see his stage show. Saw parts of it and it looked amazing.

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[info]lemurgoddess
2006-08-11 08:20 pm UTC (link)
However, you have sent put-downs at me and talked down to me enough that I find you to not be so nice to talk with.

It seems this is due more to the inability to interpret intentions of the written word through the internet, because I assure you, not a single thing I have said so far has had this intention. Not once was it my intention to "sent put-downs at you". If there is a statement I have made that was insulting or condescending to you, I implore you to point it out to me. What have you found insulting?

Why you can't talk to me openly without stating things that make it seem like I have nothing good to say is frustrating.

Again, I thought I was talking openly with you. Every word I've said was sincere and not the slightest bit of venom was attended. To what mcomentary of mine are you referring too. How do you define "talking openly" and how can I do such a thing (if I am not already)? Where have I erred? What have I said that you find frustrating?

Is it frustrating simply because I disagree with you?

If you value "talking openly" I hope you will help me figure out where our conversation has gone awry.


I am sure you feel you are 'educating' me

Nope, I'm simply sharing what I've experienced, and the thougths I've had on the subject. Do you feel like your being educated?


but what is funny is you probably will not read any of what I sent you because you refuse to feel I have anything of worth to say or know.

Do you get this reaction from people alot? If so, I am very sorry for you. But please DO NOT place this assumption on me! I read as much as I can on every subject I am able. I take in information from many sources and don't give much thought to superficial labels of conservative, liberal, what-have-you. I like information and try and process as much as I can. I will gladly check out the sources
you provide, and then some.

Are you willing to return that favor?


I guess you feel you are the 'specialist' eventhough the people I told you to read are professors at universities and have studied this faith, dealt with people of the faith and studied what is going on for a very long time.

I never said at any point that I am a "specialist" or that I am all knowledgable on this or any subject. Why do you draw this conclusion?

I consult the research and writings from the educated as well, but I also try to seek to seek the information in more than just the words of others. I look for it in my own life and the world I see around me. As I stated before, I try and draw from as many sources as possible so I can draw an accurate and well educated conclusion. And my personal interactions with Muslims has shown me that they are not all hateful, violent creatures that want the destruction of America. This shows me that the generalization is not appropriate -- this description is not applicable to all Muslims.

How do you feel when people paint about Christians in broad brush strokes? Are you a stupid, anti-science, bigoted, prude? From our limited interactions to date, I would not allow this Christian stereotype to be placed over your head.


I'd like to re-itterate, that nothing I have said carried the intention of making you feel bad or stupid. If you truly feel as if I have made inappropriate comments, please highlight them for me. If you feel attacked, let me know why.




I'm not sure if he has a seperate myspace, but he has blogged on Celldwellers MySpace about a number of things. After which girls largely faun over him. XD

Naw, I didn't see the Criss Angel thing, I don't really follow him. To be honest I don't really follow Celldweller with any consistancy. I just to check in every now and again and spin some of his tunes when I DJ.

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[info]angieohgirl
2006-08-12 02:54 pm UTC (link)
I have to admit I am one of those who fauns over both Criss and Klayton. ;)

The bigger mystery in all of this is why I get sent 3 emails when you make a comment. That is strange.

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[info]lemurgoddess
2006-08-12 09:59 pm UTC (link)
I have to admit I am one of those who fauns over both Criss and Klayton. ;)

XD

The bigger mystery in all of this is why I get sent 3 emails when you make a comment. That is strange.

Well, I'm not sure exactly why, but occasionally I will respond and then realize I've made a horrible typos that severely reduces the effectiveness of my comment, so I will edit it (repost it). So that would be my theory. Though I don't do that enough to generate 3 emails per response, so I can't explain the volume.

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(Anonymous)
2006-08-11 08:57 pm UTC (link)
Specialist Steve here. The fundamental question is the same one that I've been asking since Jihadist terrorism was visited to my homeland in 2001: Why aren't more Muslims violently seperating themselves from these terrorists carrying out mass murder in the name of Allah? The reason is because fatwas (religious decrees) about the chronology of the interpretation of the Koran, and other fundamental parts of Islamic exegesis indicate the possibility that these Islamo-facists have the proper interpretation of Mohammed's vision of the world, a universal caliphate. And that is a very dangerous prospect for any freedom loving person such as myself. It's also accepted exegesis that martyrdom is the only guaranteed extrance to Behesht, Islamic Heaven.
But before I get called a Crusader and puppet of the Bush administration or a xenophobe or anything else people want to call me after such a statement as that, let me say that this does not mean that, tomorrow or the next day, every Muslim able will start strapping themselves with dynamite vests. But other well accepted portions of Islamic and middle eastern cultures, like xenophobia and distrust of non-Muslims, make for an environment that is very difficult to investigate. The more I have studied into the Muslim faith, the closer I am forced to consider it of a very cult-like demeanor. So even those Muslims who disagree with 9/11, or 7/7, or the recently thwarted attempts to blow of trans-Atlantic flights, are not likely loudly disown these fellow Muslims, because that would be talking bad about a fellow Muslims before an infidel.
And so many good men and women of the Muslim faith only express disbelief and say things like, "He was always such a nice boy. He comes from such a respectable family." Both of those things have been said of nearly every suspect arrested in Britain this week.

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[info]revp
2006-08-11 11:57 pm UTC (link)
Why aren't more Muslims violently seperating themselves from these terrorists carrying out mass murder in the name of Allah?

http://groups.colgate.edu/aarislam/response.htm
http://www.unc.edu/%7Ekurzman/terror.htm
http://www.oic-oci.org/english/fm/11_extraordinary/declaration.htm

Maybe the fundamental question is, why hasn't this significant outpooring of condemnation of the 9/11 attacks, and terrorism in the name of Islam in general, been more widely reported? Or, are these statements unconvincing?

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(Anonymous)
2006-08-13 02:23 am UTC (link)
I'm not disagreeing that they are Muslims--many of the best and brightest Muslims in the world, especially here in America and Europe--who disagree and condemn the actions of Islamic terrorist militants. I know they're out there, and I've met many of them (strangely, most of them that I've met are Iraqis.) But they're just saying, "That's bad." They're not offering a doctrinal reasoning for why it is against the precepts of Islam. Several of them even state that many verses can be "misconstrued" to be in favor of jihad. I'm not worrying that being Muslim makes a man irrational or murderous per se. But what I am saying is that there might very well be a doctrinal leg to stand on in favor of Islam as establishing a univeral caliph, by force if necessary. Furthermore, that leg might be stronger than repeatedly saying "Islam is a religion of peace," while you hurl rockets at Israel and attempt to smuggle explosives onto airplanes.

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(Anonymous)
2006-08-13 02:24 am UTC (link)
Above post coutesy of Specialist Steve. Have a nice day.

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